Note: On April 30 and May 1, 1999, Democratic U.S. Senator Paul Wellstone from Minnesota came to Brown University to deliver a lecture. The morning after his speech, we sat down with him for a wide-ranging discussion about the current political scene. The following is a transcript of the interview. For more information on Senator Wellstone, visit hisWebsite.

A. I only want to speak in the positive about Gore. My decision was a personal one. I believe in Bradley. He is a person of immense integrity. He is someone who wants to call on people to become their best selves. He understands basic values. On the issues that I care out -- race, gender, poverty, and children -- he has good ideas. Those issues currently are off the table in American politics. I believe Bradley can win the nomination and become president of the United States.

 Q. How do you think Jesse Ventura is doing as governor of your home state of Minnesota?

A. Jesse Ventura ran a campaign of sticking it to the establishment. He is very populist in his views. It is interesting that there is a 75 percent overlap in his supporters with my own. People want him to do well as governor. He has made some remarks that have been insensitive and mistaken. He needs to work on this. There always is room for improvement. That is true for all of us.

 Q. What do you think will be the long-term impact of the Lewinsky scandal and the resulting impeachment effort on American politics?

A. It added a layer of cynicism to people. It is one of the things I am furious about with Clinton. If you read his inauguration address after the 1992 campaign, there was so much hope in it. He talked a lot about reform. What developed was the opposite of a leadership of values. He gave in to the Democratic congressional leadership. They convinced him not to emphasize reform. I was stunned when the House voted for impeachment. What the president did was egregious, but it was no threat to our security. My hope is that future representatives will be more judicious. In many ways, our constitutional principles helped us through this situation.

 Q. What is the most interesting thing about serving in the U.S. Senate?

A. To be good at being a Senator, you need to spend time with people who don't share your view. I find the public policy challenge to be real interesting. I love debate and I love being on the floor. The frustrating thing is you don't see the effects from what you do the way governors do. Much of what we do is by attaching amendments to bills. But if you can get an amendment attached to a bill and it passes, it affects everyone.

A. I hate fundraising. It is not something I enjoy doing. The other unpleasant surprise was the distorted pattern of representation that exists in Washington. People with money have more power. I hate the way big money dominates both parties. The thing I like the most is the people. I actually feel more comfortable here in the Senate than I did at Carlton College. It is easier to make friends here. I like politics. I enjoy the people. Some of the hardest-ass conservatives are people I enjoy the most. I love the Capitol building and all the monuments. I get goose-bumps every time I walk onto the floor of the Senate.

A. The most obvious thing is to get big money out of politics and to bring the people back in. There is a sense among some people in Washington that if you pay, you play and if you don't pay, you don't play. I support many of the clean government efforts. There are lots of new laws appearing in the states such as in Maine and Missouri. I believe in community organization and building politics at the local level.

 Q. How do the news media affect the way you do your job as a public official?

A. The news media don't affect the positions I take. But I do spend time working with the media. One thing that has surprised me is how much you have to take credit for what you do. I would rather not do that. But people don't know what you are working on unless someone is writing about it. I don't tailor myself to television. I am not a good sound byte person. My biggest complaint about television is how de-contextualized so much of the coverage is. I am impressed with the new technologies. The Internet is emerging as a really powerful instrument. It will be interesting to see if it makes it possible to expand democracy as opposed to furthering inequalities.

 Q. What are your personal goals for the future?

A. I want to get in better physical health. I couldn't run for the president because of my bad back. I would like to become a more effective legislator. One of the things I have done is push the envelope in the Senate. I would like to see Bradley elected president.

A. I am an old Alinsky organizer. I believe every community has a hierarchy of power. Your job is to shake it up.

A. There is a good change something will pass although there are different things that could pass. Some want to keep it off the Senate floor. Others want to pass something that looks like patient protection, but isn't. Others want more serious reform, like setting up an ombudsman program to help people. The question is who manages managed care. In general, I see the need for anti-trust legislation. Right now, 6 or 7 large insurance companies control 60 percent of the managed care market. The same is true in banking and financial services. We have seen a new reconcentration in telecommunications. I think there is a dangerous concentration of power. It has happened in energy and agriculture. Agriculture is like the 1890s when small family farmers were taking on big railroad interests. Americans don't like bigness. I think we will pass managed care legislation that will be a step forward, but it won't be universal health coverage, which is what we really need.

A. I think Bradley will talk about big ideas. One of the problems with Clinton's health care reform was it ran head-long into the problem of cost containment. He bumped up against key powers. I also think it is time to build up citizen politics to take on money politics. Bradley will do that. The core problem is representative democracy. Right now, contributors who give $1,000 produce half the money we raise, but they comprise only two-tenths of one percent of the population. Paul Simon was my best friend in politics when he was in the Senate. He has great personal integrity. But even he told me that if at the end of the day, you have 10 phone messages, you are going to call big donors first. Bradley is good on reform.

A. I am reluctant to introduce legislation now. A lot of people are piling on their agendas. I don't like that, whether I agree with the agendas or not. We need to let an interval of time go by. When I meet with people, they tell me we need to find a way to build community again and figure out ways to talk to each other more.

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